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X11, Gimp, not working

Discussion in 'GIMP for Mac' started by drkib, Apr 20, 2008.

  1. drkib

    drkib New Member

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    I'm a novice when it comes to computers. This is my first Mac, a Macbook with 2.2GHz Intel, 2G RAM and 250GB HDD. OS X 10.5.2. In my work I needed to use outlook web access in an Internet Explorer type interface and I need to use descent image editing software. 
    For OWA, I downloaded ies4osx (I had to download something called Darwine first) and chose Internet Explorer 6.0 SP1 to install (www.kronenberg.org/ies4osx/) and initially this worked fine. I noticed that every time I started IE, another program called x11 started up, I assumed this was part of the deal when using IE, so let it run. 
    I then needed to edit images, and was too tight-fisted to buy photoshop for Mac. So I found GIMP, went to the site, where I followed to the word, the instructions. First, I inserted my OSX disc, went to optional installs, ticked the x11 box and clicked the "upgrade" button. Once this operation was completed, I then read the bit that said if this was the first time I was installing x11 from the OSX disc, I had to reinstall the 10.5.2 combo update, otherwise GIMP will crash. So I downloaded the update and tried to install it, only to be told by my computer that I wasn't allowed to do this. When I tried running GIMP, it wouldn't start. So I went back to the website, which told me that if I was having trouble with this, I could use the older Tiger version, which should work anyway. So I downloaded the Tiger version, and installed it. This will not launch properly either. And no x11 application, this will not start. 
    Most of the time, a GIMP icon appears in the dock, sometimes with an x11 icon, sometimes without, either way, GIMP stops responding and I have to force quit.
    When I try to launce x11 on its own from the utilities folder, it does not open a terminal window.
     What is worse, IE wont work. So I tried everything, eventually removing IE, Darwine, and x11 (x11 from OSX disc)  and reinstalling them. x11.app appears in the utilities folder, but doesn't seem to run. When trying to reinstall IE 6.0, the installer gets stuck at "creating winprefix".
     Eventually I bought codeweavers which lets me run an old version of Photoshop, but this is very slow. Tried to get help from Apple, but they were very, very unhelpful, basically telling me to reinstall x11 (which I already did) and that they cant help with 3rd party software. 
     Can anyone help me and save me from having to install Windows on my Mac, which I really, really dont want to do.  
     
  2. sglider12

    sglider12 Active Member

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    hmm...maybe you should ask this in the wilber-loves-apple section, there you can solve all of your mac and gimp related problems ^-^ ^-^
     
  3. Auria

    Auria Member

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    Hi,

    X11 is indeed a terrible mess... in not too long we can hopefully get rid of it and make GIMP an app like all others

    I wonder why the Tiger version will not work on your computer. To know this, could you try running it from terminal? Open /Applications/Utilities/Terminal, and enter a command like

    if you installed it in a different location you may need to adapt it a little... then press enter and post back what it outputs
     
  4. dcrocks

    dcrocks New Member

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      It looks like some documentation would be very helpful right now.

    1st. X11 in 10.5 is very different from previous versions. You are NOT supposed to start it with a double click from the utilities folder. It is designed to be started automatically whenever a X11 app is started, such as Gimp. And also, it will be pre-installed by default. You have to explicitly exclude it if you don't want it.

    2nd. Gimp 2.4.5 won't work with the version of X11 (2.1.1) on 10.5.2 because of library and possibly other issues. What worked for me was to get version 2.2.0.1 from http://trac.macosforge.org/projects/xquartz and install it. Versions between 2.1.1 and 2.2.0.1 might work but but I can only confirm 2.2.0.1 does. And it uses a standard Apple mpkg for install and works whether or not X11 is already installed on your system. This is apparently Apple's working source for the X11 packages they will include with current and future versions of the OS.

      It would help if the documentation at the Gimp download web site was updated. If the docs do point to this source for X11 they will have to emphasize that any Apple maintenance could regress X11. But re-install is a 15 sec process.
        It would help if Apple would update their X11 documentation so people wouldn't continue to mis-use the new version. Two good references are below. They do take thorough reading.

    http://forums.macosxhints.com/showthread.php?t=80171
    http://homepage.mac.com/sao1/X11/index.html
     
  5. Auria

    Auria Member

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    Yes the docs shold be updated now that XQuartz 2.2 is out. My only problem, however, is that many people reported that XQuartz 2.1.4 made Gimp crash, while Apple's X11 did not. Before advising everyone to switch to XQuartz, we would need to make sure the bug that crashes gimp was fixed (i know Xquartz is fine on your computer but it didn't happen everywhere)
     
  6. dcrocks

    dcrocks New Member

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      The thing is, of course, is that Apple's X11 is XQuartz. I tried both Tiger and Leopard Gimp 2.4.5 with Apple's X11 and they both failed. One of them may work with Tiger's X11. But if you want to keep the install of Gimp as simple as possible on leopard it seems that means recommending XQuartz as a 'later' release of Apple's X11 would do it. A short download and install of each. Whichever course you take, any Apple maintenance could undo your efforts to keep a working X11.
      I would think it better to discourage installing older releases of either X11 or Gimp on a Leopard system. But you are right, though it is a rather sad thing to say about OS X and open source, a given persons experience may be wildly divergent from mine.
     
  7. Auria

    Auria Member

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    Actually you misunderstood me, what I say is that Xquartz 2.1.4 introduced new bugs that made GIMp unusable on some computers. Before making XQuartz the recommended installation we need to check that the 2.1.4 crashes have been fixed in 2.2

    Anyway, I will update the instructions to at least mention XQuartz as a possibly working easy way
     

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